[WTFO]

Almost forgot, only a complete asshat would question my service. I'm approaching 20 yrs in the Air Force with an outstanding record. Unlike many politicians (especially liberal ones) I take my oath to protect the Constitution very seriously. That includes my right to free speech. If you're too sensitive to handle it when someone returns your insults, maybe you should grow up and put on your big girl panties.

Lastly, I find it interesting that the claim "This thread started with (IMO) a racist comparison between 18th century slave owners and today's democratic party." was thrown out there. Too bad it's not based in reality. In fact, I posted an opinion about modern day slavery with the Democratic masters and made the comparison to the (mostly) Democratic slave owners of the 18th century. Then, Bull posted a completely unrelated and (IMO) stupid video. I called him out on it and he attacked. Liberals are so sensitive apparently. It wasn't until later that you trotted out the lame race card BS. So typical of a liberal with no facts to stand on to attempt to shut down the discussion by screaming "racist". Many liberal morons have attempted that with me in the past and met failure. I won't stop speaking the truth no matter how shrill you haters get.

Sad really, that liberals don't have anything but hate and slander.

[Bull]

You know what, I remember now why I chose to post a stupid song instead of arguing this. You see things as black and white (metaphorically) where there's many shades of gray between.

I do not consider myself liberal but I agree with several liberal viewpoints. Here, you tell me .......


Abortion: Nobody has the right to force their religious views on another person. If a woman gets pregnant whether by accident (failed birth control), carelessness, or it's forced upon her, I believe it is her choice. Now, I also believe that before a woman has an abortion the father should be sought out if possible and consulted.(unless he rapped her, then he should be sought out and .. well, we'll get to that) Consulted, mind you .. he's got no vote because the decision's hers.

Affirmative Action: It's 2012. We have a President that is African American. Merit should be the only factor in obtaining a job. Preferential treatment for anyone that's not based on merit is wrong.

Death Penalty: Kill them. The only problem with the death penalty is it's more expensive because of all the appeals and court costs to have someone on death row than it is for lifers. I'm fukin serious, it is more expensive to kill someone per capa than it is to sentence them to life. We need to streamline the process to make it more cost efficient. If you killed someone and 2 people saw you do it you die, Immediately. Maybe give them a month to get their affairs in order. I also believe rapists should be put to death as well. Maybe not on the first offense, rehabilitation is always possible, but for multiple offenders I say kill em.

Economy: I don't like big business. Huge corporations suck the life out of our economy in my opinion. I think there needs to be a limit on how big a corporation can grow. But I also believe in free market. Pisses me off that if I don't like my local utilities companies I can't shop for a new one or cable & internet for that matter. Gov't needs to regulate big business but only to the point of maintaining fair and balanced competition. Imagine a professional football game without any refs. It would be all out chaos, there wouldn't be a game. Now imagine that same game but with as many refs on the field as there are players. Would be the most boring thing to watch since drying paint.

Education: I'm liberal on this issue. We should take all the billions we spend developing futuristic war machines and education should be our largest budget expenditure. If we put half the money we spend on defense into our school system we wouldn't need private schools. We would be able to pay our teachers what they deserve. And a teacher's union? What other federal job has a union? Fuk that, you're a federal employee. You've got all the job security of any other federal employee. You're not special.

Embryonic Stem Cell Research: Liberal. I don't believe in a magical wizard in the clouds that pulls everyone's strings like a puppet. Embryonic cells are just that. Cells. There's no intelligence there yet and research could potentially cure hundreds of diseases. There should be regulations though. These scientists shouldn't be doing crazy experiments like trying to clone a human or crossing our DNA with like snakes or some dumb shyt. One of them gets caught doing some repugnant shyt like that then see capitol punishment. Again, my opinion.

Energy: This is a doozy here. Most of you think that the oil we pull from the US is ours. It's not, it belongs to the corporations that drill it and they are allowed to sell it to whomever they damn well please on the world market. We're drilling more domestic oil right now than we have in over 10 years. We're using less too, like 25% less than we were 10 years ago. Problem is oil prices are rising on the world market because Asia is using more, The UN is putting trade embargos on Iran which supply Asia with most of their oil, a good chunk of capitol that was used to invest in the housing market is now going to oil futures which raises the price of crude in the future .... it's a big fuking mess and there's no simple solution. We do need to invest in a better energy source but unless some genius comes up with a way to separate the hydrogen from the oxygen in water so both can be used to produce energy .. and do it without an outside energy source .. well, there's always nuclear energy? Come on, don't be a pussy. Electric cars powered off a grid of thousands of nuclear reactors. We're not actually going to drop nukes on other countries and they all know this. Might as well use them to get off the oil tit.

Euthanasia: Liberal. If someone has lived a long life and is dying of a terminal sickness AND they want to die, kill them. It's cheaper than drawing out their suffering for the same conclusion. If I ever get cancer fuk treatment, I'm gonna pack a backpack, grab my rifle, and head off into the wilderness like a dog does. Nature will kill me.

Global Warming: We're having an impact on the planet. Everything we do has an impact no matter how small. The thing is, I don't care. I'll be dead long before it's a problem so why waist time thinking about it.

Gun Control: yeah .. fuk you, I've got a couple long guns. Can't legally own a hand gun anymore. Normal citizens don't need fukin oozies and AK's to defend their homes. When's the last time you were shooting at intruders and thought "damn I need a fukin machine gun, their's hundreds of these fukers!" and you weren't playing a video game?

Health Care: Yeah, my household income is based off gov't staying away from healthcare. Do I think every citizen should be entitled to it? Perhaps, but it's against my best interests so I'm biased.

Immigration: Illegals become illegals because they're so poor they can't afford to immigrate legally, for the most part. They do a lot of jobs like picking produce that if we paid minimum wage most Americans wouldn't be able to afford a salad. They also don't file tax returns which means the govt keeps any excess taxes they collect. Do I think we should kick illegals out and keep them out? Not unless their criminals (and I mean real criminals, not just sneaking in the country). Do I think we should just make them citizens? No. I don't think they have a right to educational and health benefits that Americans receive but I also don't think we should just round them up and deport them either. There's got to be a middle ground. I think Obama's recent executive action on this was B.S. It's a good idea but he circumvented Congress which is not how this shyt works.

Private Property: Fuk eminent domain. The govt tries to take my property there's going to be a standoff and I will be armed.

Religion and Government: There's a fine line between acknowledging god and teaching religion. As long as no school (unless it's a religious school) or other gov't establishment crosses it then I really don't care. I don't believe in it but I respect the rights of others to practice religion.

Same-sex Marriage: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof ... So there's your answer. Same sex couples want to get married, create another branch of Christianity or wtf ever religion. Bam, they can get married. You are not allowed to impose your religious beliefs on others. But what I think the real issue with it is, when you get married your tax status changes. Married couples get tax incentives. So it all boils down to money. IMO

Social Security: the reason the SS program is so fuked up is some members of congress had the great idea that they could borrow capital from it and pay it back interest free so they passed a bill. Not sure which party did it or when it happened (it was early 50's I think) but that's why SS is fuked, their borrowing money from it, that money is not making interest because it's not there, they're putting it back without paying a vig, and the system's bleeding capitol. It might recover if they kept their greasy mitts off it but that'll be like getting those crooked fukers to not vote themselves a pay raise. Whoever thought up that shyt was an a$$hole too.

Taxes: The tax policy that Obama got rolling when he was elected really helped my wife and I. We were bringing in about 50k a year four years ago and now we'll make about 120k this year. Before we were scraping by week to week but once we got a bit of relief we were able to put extra back and create a nest egg because we lived below our means and did not go spending it. Income taxes are fine, it's the capitol gains cuts of Bush that fuked up the system. Rich guys like Romney buy stocks that produce equity which is an income they create by not doing shyt. And they don't want to pay taxes on their money they didn't have to work for. Sound good to you? Sounds like a big dik in the eye to me. After what those bankers & wallstreet fukers did, what was it, 6 yrs ago? does anyone with half a thought really care about them paying capitol gains? oh and the estate tax. Basically a rich guy dies and before his shyt goes to his kids uncle sam takes a piece. The guy that worked for that fortune is dead, junior's getting it handed to him, wtf shouldn't uncle sam take a piece?

United Nations: The concept is a good idea but the way it's run it retarded. The US shouldn't be a member of the UN, we should be leading the damn thing. If we're really going to police the world than I think we need a police force to command. Run that shyt like a major corporation, we're the CEO and the rest of those countries are the board. (I know a some of you Canadians probably aren't going to like this idea but that's ok, I don't like alex trebec or justin bieber)

War on Terror/Terrorism: So now we've got a police force. We use our intelligence agencies in along with the UN to hunt them down. The war on terror is like the war on drugs, obesity, poverty, etc. It's fought with police work not armies. We can also stop pissing off half the world and making them want to kill us but you can wish in one hand and shyt in the other.

Welfare: You need help, uncle sam's got your back. You want to sit on your ass and get paid, move to france. We should assist the poor when they need it, but long term welfare is a bad idea. You feed a stray cat and he'll keep coming back until you stop. Clinton had some good welfare reforms.


I got all these talking points from here .. http://www.studentnewsdaily.com/conserv ... l-beliefs/

Read it, think .. decide where you stand on an issue and what you think should be done, and we can have a conversation.

...................................

Oh and I caught your reply while I was typing this, I don't think we need a play by play, we can all read. How would you like it if I made a comparison like that about conservatives and the nazis? Don't think you'd jump right in all friendly and shyt and start a discussion. Your posting is inflammatory not to mention disrespectful. The enslavement of a people is not a basis for comparison to a political philosophy. That's all I'm going to say about it.

As for the other thing .. didn't cranky quote you as saying you dropped out of high school in 10th grade? and then you said something about almost having a masters in aerospace or some shyt? and now you're in the airforce for damn near 20 yrs while your doing this? And you're on here talking hate with a bunch of teenagers with impressionable minds who probably look up to you if you've told them you're in the military. And I'm supposed to believe this? How about actions speak louder than words? I came in here, read what you'd wrote, posted a silly song in response, and on another thread you attacked me for having a different point of view than you do.

Now, before you respond to anything in this post I want you to go back through it and find one derogatory statement I made about you. Finished? I count 3 in your last post. I did not retaliate. You think we can all put on our big boy pants now and stop acting like children?

[arnnatz]

Here's where I take exception with your posting:

Abortion: When it comes down to selective abortion, nobody wins. Just because someone wanted a boy and it turns out the fetus is a girl, that girl should not be terminated. When abortion is used to obtain fetal stem cells, there is also an issue in my opinion. Abortion in certain instances (e.g. the mother's life is at stake, rape, and a few others) should be legal, but using abortion as a solution to forgetting to use your free, sandra fluke inspired birth control is simply wrong and should not be allowed.

energy You said it belongs to the corporations that drill it. That may be true for oil drilled on private lands, but oil that is pulled from public lands should (and can be by contract or legislation) be required to stay right here in the USA.

Global Warming If global warming is not cyclic, which historic records show that it most likely is (e.g. the mini ice age during the revolutionary war, the cooling during the 1970s (I may be off on when that one was), why did the "world's foremost experts on global warming" from the University of East Angola have to lie and skew data to prove it? Why are the sensors placed in areas where the readings are not only suspect, but in some cases totally invalid (e.g. placing a temperature sensor where an air conditioner exhaust blows on it or in a parking lot where the heat from the asphalt forces a higher heat signature)

illegal immigration The latest move by obama to force the DREAM act on the US population was a total farce. It was completely political in nature. Otherwise, why would he wait until 3 1/2 years into his administration when his poll numbers are slumping and hispanics are beginning to realize that obama made promises to the latino community that he had no intention of keeping? Just because someone is poor in another country does mean that the US is responsible for the well being of that person. If we had no poor in this country, it would be different matter. I think the priority should be to make sure that legal americans are taken care of before illegals. Why encourage more illegals to come here with that carrot?

same sex marriage You said there were financial benefits from taxes to be a married couple. That is completely wrong. If you look at the tax tables, you will find that there is, indeed, a marriage penalty built into the tax codes. So, no, in my opinion, it doesn't come down to money. You also quoted the religion thing which I can't figure out how it applies to gay marriage. Are you saying that being gay is a religion?

[KALKAM]

Global Warming: We're having an impact on the planet. Everything we do has an impact no matter how small. The thing is, I don't care. I'll be dead long before it's a problem so why waist time thinking about it.

Agreed...all life has an impact. I couldn't care less about what will be when I die anymore than I cared how the climate changed many times prior to my birth.

Every Earth Day I set tires on fire...I burn one for every mention I overhear. Want to save the environment? Never mention it in my presence...

Gun Control: yeah .. fuk you, I've got a couple long guns. Can't legally own a hand gun anymore. Normal citizens don't need fukin oozies and AK's to defend their homes. When's the last time you were shooting at intruders and thought "damn I need a fukin machine gun, their's hundreds of these fukers!" and you weren't playing a video game?



Private Property: Fuk eminent domain. The govt tries to take my property there's going to be a standoff and I will be armed.

That's exactly what my arsenal is for...it's not for burglars.

I ask law enforcement if they think their paycheck means more to them than my freedom and my ass' virginity means to me....

Bottom line is this...and I really mean this....I will never lose my freedom... Anyone seeking to take my freedom dies...and I love out-gunning any would-be enemy.

Mutually Assured Destruction works....

I agree with Arnnatz's points.

As for euthanasia...I don't plan on dying helpless or in agony. Would be nice for everyone if I had a painless way to go...as it stands I just plan on taking my enemies with me.

As for abortion...if it's a woman's right to do as she pleases with her body and the body growing in her due to her irresponsibility then I never want to hear how men can't take steroids, smoke, eat trans-fat etc.....after all it's their body.

And if women can suck the brains out of a fetus' skull then I hope the same people will STFU about circumcision....although I don't expect San Francisco to grasp this point.


Oh yeah, as for those who consistently think pointing out to me that "even if the US cut our military spending in half it would still be the highest in the world" is going to get me to support cutting it...well, they are wrong...it only makes me want to increase it.

I want to weaponize space and have sole dominance of it...I want war with the US to be total suicide for any nation.

[Bull]

FIrst of all, these are all just my opinions. My positions on each issue.

Here's where I take exception with your posting:

Abortion: When it comes down to selective abortion, nobody wins. Just because someone wanted a boy and it turns out the fetus is a girl, that girl should not be terminated. When abortion is used to obtain fetal stem cells, there is also an issue in my opinion. Abortion in certain instances (e.g. the mother's life is at stake, rape, and a few others) should be legal, but using abortion as a solution to forgetting to use your free, sandra fluke inspired birth control is simply wrong and should not be allowed.

Is it even possible to tell the sex in the stages that it's legal to get an abortion? I don't know, that's why I'm asking. I agree that that's B.S. but who's doing that here? I mean we're not China. I don't think abortion is how they obtain fetal stem cells. They take donated sperm, donated eggs, scramble them up in a test tube (or however the hell they do it) and that's how they get stem cells.

As to your last sentence, I can see where you're coming from, we don't want it to be a quick fix to a mistake. It shouldn't be easy to get an abortion. But, there are over 7 billion (I think that's the latest numbers) people on this planet and the ones that are breeding the most are the poor, weak, not so smart ones. We don't live in the wilderness anymore where it's survival of the fittest. The weak do not get thinned from the herd and then we end up taking care of them. If it wasn't for the religious aspect of it I think most conservatives would agree with abortion. It's a sure way of saving tax money on future welfare.

energy You said it belongs to the corporations that drill it. That may be true for oil drilled on private lands, but oil that is pulled from public lands should (and can be by contract or legislation) be required to stay right here in the USA.

I only mean that it doesn't belong to the federal govt. Who's drilling on public lands? Thought corporations would buy up lands to drill on and it's illegal to drill in public parks etc? There's another problem with that too, oil is a good chunk of our trade exports. If we start keeping our own oil whether it be through govt seizure or whatever we loose billions in trade. Don't we already have a trade deficit? I'm just saying.

Global Warming

Yeah, I really don't care. it's warm in the summer and cold in the winter where I live and I doubt it's ever going to change in my lifetime. Whether climate change is our doing or natural ... let's just put like this, humans haven't been around long enough to study earth's climate fluxes.

illegal immigration The latest move by obama to force the DREAM act on the US population was a total farce. It was completely political in nature. Otherwise, why would he wait until 3 1/2 years into his administration when his poll numbers are slumping and hispanics are beginning to realize that obama made promises to the latino community that he had no intention of keeping? Just because someone is poor in another country does mean that the US is responsible for the well being of that person. If we had no poor in this country, it would be different matter. I think the priority should be to make sure that legal americans are taken care of before illegals. Why encourage more illegals to come here with that carrot?

Yep, that's what I said. I think you meant "Just because someone is poor in another country does not mean that the US is responsible for the well being of that person." And yes, I totally agree. We should take care of our own first. US citizens get the benefits from being US citizens and the rest can have what's left if there's anything.

Even though I agree that Obama's latest move on this was totally political and borderline unconstitutional, I do agree with the spirit of it. Imagine you growing up in america ... you think your a US citizen ... but when you go to get a driver's license or apply for a job you discover that your parents brought you here as an infant and you're not a citizen. Now you're going to get deported back to a country you don't know. It's the way he did it that pisses me off. Republicans and Democrats used to work together on issues like this, now it's one side vs the other and it doesn't matter what the issue is, could be ice cream, one would take chocolate the other vanilla, you'd have varying degrees in between. Why can't we all just eat pie.

same sex marriage You said there were financial benefits from taxes to be a married couple. That is completely wrong. If you look at the tax tables, you will find that there is, indeed, a marriage penalty built into the tax codes. So, no, in my opinion, it doesn't come down to money. You also quoted the religion thing which I can't figure out how it applies to gay marriage. Are you saying that being gay is a religion?

When my wife and I got married we started getting a lot more back in income taxes.
http://askville.amazon.com/claim-single ... tId=829008
If you can find something to dispute that then I'll read it ... I was always under the impression that married filing jointly got you better tax breaks.

Lol, no I wasn't saying gay should be a religion. I was saying that perhaps a group of people could break off from the church and form a new one, like how there's protestants, baptists, lutherans, presbyterians, etc. Hell, you probably don't even need to make a new one, just convince one of those to accept gay marriage. Everything has a loophole. HA!! get it?? Loophole!!!!

[arnnatz]

You are correct that I meant does NOT mean ...

The folks at turbotax describe the marriage penalty this way:

You've undoubtedly heard about the so-called marriage tax penalty, the quirk in the tax law that sometimes makes married couples pay more income tax than they would if they had remained single.

Here's a little secret: Many married couples actually get a marriage bonus, paying less income tax than if they stayed single. At issue is the graduated nature of the tax system, which applies higher tax rates to higher levels of income. When you pile one person's income on top of another's on a joint tax return, it can sometimes push some of that income into a higher tax bracket.

Congress has taken steps to reduce the impact of the marriage penalty. For 2010, the ceilings for the top of the 10 percent and 15 percent brackets on joint returns are precisely twice as high as the ceilings on single returns (that was not always the case). As incomes rise into higher brackets, though, the tax ceilings on a joint return aren't quite double the ceilings on a single return. That can cause a marriage penalty, but it doesn't guarantee one.

The more unequal two spouses' incomes, the more likely that combining them on a joint return will pull some of the higher-earner's income into a lower bracket. That's when the marriage bonus occurs.

On the other hand, when the two spouses have more equal incomes, and they are both substantial, the odds of getting hit with the the marriage penalty go up.

some newer ultrasound technology can determine a baby’s gender as early as 12 or 13 weeks. Of course there are always witch doctors who can tell you before your spouse gets pregnant what the gender is going to be.

As far as drilling on public lands, I think it's mostly on tribal territory, but I could be wrong. Isn't Anwar public land? Obama has seen fit to reduce the number of drilling permits over the number that bush's administration allowed. I don't think that the amount of oil pulled out of public lands would make much of a dent in the trade deficit, but it might make a difference in the dependence on foreign oil.

[KALKAM]

some newer ultrasound technology can determine a baby’s gender as early as 12 or 13 weeks. Of course there are always witch doctors who can tell you before your spouse gets pregnant what the gender is going to be.

This will soon be considered a right as well...

As far as drilling on public lands, I think it's mostly on tribal territory, but I could be wrong. Isn't Anwar public land? Obama has seen fit to reduce the number of drilling permits over the number that bush's administration allowed. I don't think that the amount of oil pulled out of public lands would make much of a dent in the trade deficit, but it might make a difference in the dependence on foreign oil.

I'm on the fence with this simply because I would prefer to deplete foreign reserves first. But as a backup safeguard to another OPEC boycott I completely favor it.

[WTFO]

You know what, I remember now why I chose to post a stupid song instead of arguing this. You see things as black and white (metaphorically) where there's many shades of gray between.

I don't consider most things in "black and white", I examine many things by right and wrong. From that perspective things are much more clear.

I do not consider myself liberal but I agree with several liberal viewpoints. Here, you tell me .......
blah blah blah.

That's all very interesting and if I get some time I'd enjoy discussing these topics. However, they have absolutely nothing to do with this thread's topic (the types of liberals and the progressive plantation, in case you forgot). If you don't have the courage to debate me on my positions, then don't post in this thread. I get tired of liberal tactics of distraction.

Oh and I caught your reply while I was typing this, I don't think we need a play by play, we can all read. How would you like it if I made a comparison like that about conservatives and the nazis? Don't think you'd jump right in all friendly and shyt and start a discussion. Your posting is inflammatory not to mention disrespectful. The enslavement of a people is not a basis for comparison to a political philosophy. That's all I'm going to say about it.

My position is a valid analogy of how the democratic machine operates to create victims and farm them for votes. The modern chains are welfare and entitlement programs, and the modern cotton is democratic votes. If that offends you, tough. I will not shy away from the truth because it might offend your tender sensibilities. If you don't want to discuss the comparison, fine, don't. But in that case, jump out of this thread so an honest debate can occur instead of flooding it with unrelated data or ignorant music videos.

Also, thank you ever so much for throwing out that tired liberal lie that conservatives and nazis are similar. Here is how I respond to that: the fact is that modern day liberals and progressives have a lot in common with nazi Germany. Want proof? Here you go: (I underlined a few key points for easy reading)
--------------
LIBERALS and NAZIS

Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2004 1:35:08 AM by Capitalism2003

"We ask that the government undertake the obligation above all of providing citizens with adequate opportunity for employment and earning a living. The activities of the individual must not be allowed to clash with the interests of the community, but must take place within its confines and be for the good of all. Therefore, we demand: … an end to the power of the financial interests. We demand profit sharing in big business. We demand a broad extension of care for the aged. We demand … the greatest possible consideration of small business in the purchases of national, state, and municipal governments. In order to make possible to every capable and industrious [citizen] the attainment of higher education and thus the achievement of a post of leadership, the government must provide an all-around enlargement of our entire system of public education … We demand the education at government expense of gifted children of poor parents … The government must undertake the improvement of public health – by protecting mother and child, by prohibiting child labor … by the greatest possible support for all clubs concerned with the physical education of youth. We combat the … materialistic spirit within and without us, and are convinced that a permanent recovery of our people can only proceed from within on the foundation of the common good before the individual good."

– From the political program of the Nazi Party, adopted in Munich, February 24, 1920

The similarities between the National Socialist (Nazi) platform and the modern liberal/socialist agenda are truely astonishing. Nationalization of business, forced profit sharing, outlawing all profits during wartime, abolition of all income not earned directly from work (via high capital gains/inheritance taxes), the state shall provide a "livelihood for its citizens", old age insurance funded by government, price caps, price controls, rent controls, laws against speculation.."communal" rent free living areas, an end to the "materialistic" world order, free higher education focusing on "civic affairs" (humanities, political science--the left's favorite (and useless) subjects to learn), labor laws, censorship against news media that don't tow the line (libs demanding "fairness doctrine, increased penalties/regulation against clear channel, newscorp, etc)...bottom line, "common good..."common interest" before individual interest, and a strong central government to make these goals come true...mainly through economic coercion and force. The left wing parties of TODAY condemn individual achievement at every turn. Their aim is to remove every reason for individuals to excel in this society, and to create a class of dependent people subservient to the almighty state. They justify economic oppression in the name of "social justice" or the promoting "common good." Much like the Nazis, they support extreme infringements on personal liberties. Like the Nazis, they favor MASSIVE taxation, massive regulation, and often support government takeover of entire industries (Hellarycare in 92, etc
No further words are necessary...just read closely.

"We are socialists, we are enemies of today's capitalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance, and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions." --Adolf Hitler

(Speech of May 1, 1927. Quoted by Toland, 1976, p. 306)

[Below is the 25 of the NSDAP Program - This is basically the National Socialist German Workers Party Platform. It included measures that in effect would redistribute income and war profits, profit-sharing with large industries, nationalization of trusts, extensive development of old-age pension (just like FDRs Social Security Program), and free education. Clearly this demonstrates Hitler was indeed a left winger and here is startling proof.]

---------------------------------------------------------

The 25 points of the NSDAP Program were composed by Adolf Hitler and Anton Drexler. They were publically presented on 24 February 1920 "to a crowd of almost two thousand and every single point was accepted amid jubilant approval." (Mein Kampf, Volume II, Chapter I) Hitler explained their purpose in the fifth chapter of the second volume of Mein Kampf:

[T]he program of the new movement was summed up in a few guiding principles, twenty-five in all. They were devised to give, primarily to the man of the people, a rough picture of the movement's aims. They are in a sense a political creed, which on the one hand recruits for the movement and on the other is suited to unite and weld together by a commonly recognized obligation those who have been recruited.

Hitler was intent on having a community of mutual interest that desired mutual success instead of one that was divided over the control of money or differing values.

THE COMMON INTEREST BEFORE SELF-INTEREST - THAT IS THE SPIRIT OF THE PROGRAM. BREAKING OF THE THRALDOM OF INDIVIDUAL INTEREST - THAT IS THE KERNEL OF NATIONAL SOCIALISM.

In these straightforward statements of intent, Hitler translated his ideology into a plan of action which would prove its popularity with the German people throughout the coming years. For many, the abruptness of its departure from the tradition of politics as practiced in the western world was as much of a shock as its liberal nature and foresight of the emerging problems of western democracy.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Programme of the German Workers' Party is designed to be of limited duration. The leaders have no intention, once the aims announced in it have been achieved, of establishing fresh ones, merely in order to increase, artificially, the discontent of the masses and so ensure the continued existence of the Party.

1. We demand the union of all Germany in a Greater Germany on the basis of the right of national self-determination.

2. We demand equality of rights for the German people in its dealings with other nations, and the revocation of the peace treaties of Versailles and Saint-Germain.

3. We demand land and territory (colonies) to feed our people and to settle our surplus population.

4. Only members of the nation may be citizens of the State. Only those of German blood, whatever be their creed, may be members of the nation. Accordingly, no Jew may be a member of the nation.

5. Non-citizens may live in Germany only as guests and must be subject to laws for aliens.

6. The right to vote on the State's government and legislation shall be enjoyed by the citizens of the State alone. We demand therefore that all official appointments, of whatever kind, whether in the Reich, in the states or in the smaller localities, shall be held by none but citizens.

We oppose the corrupting parliamentary custom of filling posts merely in accordance with party considerations, and without reference to character or abilities.

7. We demand that the State shall make it its primary duty to provide a livelihood for its citizens. If it should prove impossible to feed the entire population, foreign nationals (non-citizens) must be deported from the Reich.

8. All non-German immigration must be prevented. We demand that all non-Germans who entered Germany after 2 August 1914 shall be required to leave the Reich forthwith.

9. All citizens shall have equal rights and duties.

10. It must be the first duty of every citizen to perform physical or mental work. The activities of the individual must not clash with the general interest, but must proceed within the framework of the community and be for the general good.

We demand therefore:

11. The abolition of incomes unearned by work.

The breaking of the slavery of interest

12. In view of the enormous sacrifices of life and property demanded of a nation by any war, personal enrichment from war must be regarded as a crime against the nation. We demand therefore the ruthless confiscation of all war profits.

13. We demand the nationalization of all businesses which have been formed into corporations (trusts).

14. We demand profit-sharing in large industrial enterprises.

15. We demand the extensive development of insurance for old age.

16. We demand the creation and maintenance of a healthy middle class, the immediate communalizing of big department stores, and their lease at a cheap rate to small traders, and that the utmost consideration shall be shown to all small traders in the placing of State and municiple orders.

17. We demand a land reform suitable to our national requirements, the passing of a law for the expropriation of land for communal purposes without compensation; the abolition of ground rent, and the prohibition of all speculation in land. *

18. We demand the ruthless prosecution of those whose activities are injurious to the common interest. Common criminals, usurers, profiteers, etc., must be punished with death, whatever their creed or race.

19. We demand that Roman Law, which serves a materialistic world order, be replaced by a German common law.

20. The State must consider a thorough reconstruction of our national system of education (with the aim of opening up to every able and hard-working German the possibility of higher education and of thus obtaining advancement). The curricula of all educational establishments must be brought into line with the requirements of practical life. The aim of the school must be to give the pupil, beginning with the first sign of intelligence, a grasp of the nation of the State (through the study of civic affairs). We demand the education of gifted children of poor parents, whatever their class or occupation, at the expense of the State.

21. The State must ensure that the nation's health standards are raised by protecting mothers and infants, by prohibiting child labor, by promoting physical strength through legislation providing for compulsory gymnastics and sports, and by the extensive support of clubs engaged in the physical training of youth.

22. We demand the abolition of the mercenary army and the foundation of a people's army.

23. We demand legal warfare on deliberate political mendacity and its dissemination in the press. To facilitate the creation of a German national press we demand:

(a) that all editors of, and contributors to newspapers appearing in the German language must be members of the nation; (b) that no non-German newspapers may appear without the express permission of the State. They must not be printed in the German language; (c) that non-Germans shall be prohibited by law from participating financially in or influencing German newspapers, and that the penalty for contravening such a law shall be the suppression of any such newspaper, and the immediate deportation of the non-Germans involved.

The publishing of papers which are not conducive to the national welfare must be forbidden. We demand the legal prosecution of all those tendencies in art and literature which corrupt our national life, and the suppression of cultural events which violate this demand.

24. We demand freedom for all religious denominations in the State, provided they do not threaten its existence not offend the moral feelings of the German race.

The Party, as such, stands for positive Christianity, but does not commit itself to any particular denomination. It combats the Jewish-materialistic spirit within and without us, and is convinced that our nation can achieve permanent health only from within on the basis of the principle: The common interest before self-interest.

25. To put the whole of this programme into effect, we demand the creation of a strong central state power for the Reich; the unconditional authority of the political central Parliament over the entire Reich and its organizations; and the formation of Corporations based on estate and occupation for the purpose of carrying out the general legislation passed by the Reich in the various German states.

The leaders of the Party promise to work ruthlessly -- if need be to sacrifice their very lives -- to translate this programme into action. ___________________________________________-

As you can see, the official Nazi platform is an almost word for word copy of what leftist parties around the globe are promoting TODAY. Astonishing really.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1141684/posts
-------------------

Now, if the (accurate) comparison between the types of liberals and where they fit on the slave plantation analogy offended and upset you, I imagine these facts will really raise your blood-pressure.

As for the other thing .. didn't cranky quote you as saying you dropped out of high school in 10th grade?

Cranky is a lying troll. I never said that. It's just further evidence why he isn't worth my time.

and then you said something about almost having a masters in aerospace or some shyt? and now you're in the airforce for damn near 20 yrs while your doing this?

Working on my Master's while serving in the AF, yes.

And you're on here talking hate with a bunch of teenagers with impressionable minds who probably look up to you if you've told them you're in the military. And I'm supposed to believe this? How about actions speak louder than words? I came in here, read what you'd wrote, posted a silly song in response, and on another thread you attacked me for having a different point of view than you do.

I don't talk about hate. I tell the truth based on facts and evidence. I've backed up my positions at every turn. Also, why do you liberals on this site always feel the need to attempt to condescend others here who disagree with you? From the discussions I've had with conservatives on this site, they are all well educated adults that are tired of liberal BS. I have not engaged with "teenagers with impressionable minds" on the conservative side. However, it's clear that several of the liberals on this site would fit in that category based on the immature belief systems they cling so desparately to. I am not a role model on this site, I'm a contributing member. Me and the other conservatives on this site have mutual respect but nobody is "looking up" to other members.

Honestly, I don't give a damn if you believe that I serve or not. Some random online hater's opinion of me doesn't cost me a second of sleep. As for your crying about me blasting your addition to a stupid song in my thread, oh well, life is tough-get a helmet. I serve in the military, our mission is to support and defend the US Constitution. We do that by killing enemies and making large holes in their countries. Do you really expect me to be gentle in my interactions online as to not offend some whiny liberal? Sorry, that's not how I work. If I offend you and you can't handle it, then ignore my posts and don't engage. It's simply that easy. And make no mistake, I didn't go after you in the other thread because you have a "different point of view", I went after you because your point of view was ignorant.

Now, before you respond to anything in this post I want you to go back through it and find one derogatory statement I made about you. Finished? I count 3 in your last post. I did not retaliate. You think we can all put on our big boy pants now and stop acting like children?

Challenge accepted:
"Obama repeals don't ask don't tell and now you and BillyBob don't have to hide your forbidden love any longer"
"you keep spewing racist comments" (BTW, you still haven't shown one bit of evidence of that lie)
"Get it together retard"
"if you homos can keep your hands off each other's a$$es"
"you got some issues Retard. Does your boyfriend know you talk to other men like that? I bet you're mommy didn't breast feed you enough as a child then daddy found out he could sneak into your room at night and touch you in your naughty hole huh? Well it's ok, retard. A few years of therapy and some anger management should help you get over your homophobia and accept yourself as a gay man. Might help with your underlying racism too.
Remember, wash your hands with soap and water after you get done fingering your boyfriend's honeypot. Wouldn't want to get sick and miss work.
Night Retard!"
"You're right there with the rest of these mindless children just flinging insults"
"Yeah, because I fukin despise bullies. I've dealt with your kind all my life"
"So fuk you"
"steer it back to a discussion. Hard to do when there's no adults present"
"there's no fukin way your dumbass was ever in the military, no soldier of any US military branch would ever be as disrespectful as you are to another human being" (No we aren't disrespectful of other human beings, we just kill them. BTW, I'm an Airman, not a soldier)
"you can go fuk yourself"

Oh, wait. You asked me to "find one derogatory statement", not 11. I guess all my military experience has made me always look to go above and beyond.

Let me also point out this very interesting comment by you:

"I actually have neighbors down the street who are gay. Nicest guys you'd ever meet."

Wow, that makes you sound so accepting of the gay lifestyle. How admirable. However, I wonder what your neighbors would think of how you characterized gay life in the attacks you have spewed here against me and other members. You think that your words might offend them? Look at the words you used and what it says about your views on homosexuality. That certainly could be construed as homophobia. I bet they'd even consider you to be a bully against gays with that kind of attack (hey, didn't you say you go after bullies? Always remember to fix yourself first)

Bottom line: don't try to take the high road when you're acting like a hateful troll. It's pathetic and we can all see what kind of a low-life you really are. And you really shouldn't get your panties in a bunch when someone slaps you back.

You want to have a respectful discussion, fine. Then step up to the plate and stop typing misspelled vulgarity every 5 words. Make a rational attempt at discussing the topic instead of crying "racism" when it doesn't exist (in case you were too lazy to read it, the liberal plantation is not based on race, it's based on entitlement spending).

[Bull]

Oh, wait. You asked me to "find one derogatory statement", not 11. I guess all my military experience has made me always look to go above and beyond.

Too bad you can't read too well.

Wow, that makes you sound so accepting of the gay lifestyle. How admirable. However, I wonder what your neighbors would think of how you characterized gay life in the attacks you have spewed here against me and other members. You think that your words might offend them? Look at the words you used and what it says about your views on homosexuality. That certainly could be construed as homophobia. I bet they'd even consider you to be a bully against gays with that kind of attack (hey, didn't you say you go after bullies? Always remember to fix yourself first)

Well, not that you'd believe me, (or that I'd care if you didn't) but one of my neighbors has been through this forum extensively and told me to say most of it ... I don't gay bash as a hobby. As for bullies .. well, in my experience all a bully understands is retaliation. And I have a lot of experience, I was a small kid growing up and was constantly bullied.

I didn't go after you in the other thread because you have a "different point of view", I went after you because your point of view was ignorant.

You shouldn't have gone off on me for any reason. Is that all you guys want is just a forum full of one sided opinions and right wing talking points? No interest in hearing what the other side might have to say? That's the problem with politics in this country, everyone's either so far on the left or so far on the right that there's no middle ground anymore and instead of compromise we've got conflict. Well how's that working out for you? Oh wait, you've got a job right? Getting paid and a free education .. right?

My position is a valid analogy of how the democratic machine operates to create victims and farm them for votes. The modern chains are welfare and entitlement programs, and the modern cotton is democratic votes. If that offends you, tough. I will not shy away from the truth because it might offend your tender sensibilities.

Do you have any fellow students around who might happen to be black? Preferably someone who might share your political views? Let him read that, then after he's punched you in the face ask him if he thought your analogy was accurate.

Also, thank you ever so much for throwing out that tired liberal lie that conservatives and nazis are similar.

Seriously? Go back and read what I wrote word for word. I never compared conservatives to nazis or said they were similar, I said you wouldn't jump right in all friendly and sh*t and have a discussion about it if I had.

...

And because you're that big of an idiot I'm not really going to bother with the rest of that mess. But for the record, fascism and socialism do share some of the same beliefs and values. Liberalism has nothing to do with it. A liberal idea can be achieved through capitalistic means. You mix and match these words like they all mean the same thing and they don't. Perhaps you should study Liberalism a bit because I don't think you know what it means. Sounds to me like you're just some snot nosed kid that by some miracle got into Arizona State.

[WTFO]

Well, not that you'd believe me, (or that I'd care if you didn't) but one of my neighbors has been through this forum extensively and told me to say most of it ... I don't gay bash as a hobby. As for bullies .. well, in my experience all a bully understands is retaliation. And I have a lot of experience, I was a small kid growing up and was constantly bullied.

Well, no. I don't believe you. However, if your gay neighbor did tell you "to say most of it", then it reinforces my belief that you can't think or act for yourself, which is very typical of liberals. I also, enjoyed your comments on bullies. So let me sum that up, the dork who was (and in all probability still is) receiving swirlies in school is an online knight in shining armor rushing to the defense of the poor bullied masses in cyberspace. That's rich. Really, thanks for the laugh. While Cranky is a troll, I do believe he is a big boy who doesn't need help.

Oh wait, you've got a job right? Getting paid and a free education .. right?

Not that I'd expect a childish guy like you to understand the difference, but I serve my nation. That is not what I'd consider a "job" in the traditional sense of the word. Yes, I get paid. However, it's much less than I would in the civilian marketplace but I don't serve for money (again, selfish liberals don't understand that concept either). While there are education programs that help defray the cost of education, it is not free. I have paid into the system and continue to work for my education benefits (tuition assistance, leave, medical, etc are all benefits that are considered part of my pay).

Do you have any fellow students around who might happen to be black? Preferably someone who might share your political views? Let him read that, then after he's punched you in the face ask him if he thought your analogy was accurate.

Keep pounding the race drum but nobody is listening. If you keep repeating your lie maybe someone will believe it, right? Wrong. One more time since you are apparently a slow learner, the liberal plantation is not about race. There are more whites in democratic slavery than blacks. I have shared this belief with others of several races (yes, including blacks) and surprise, nobody hit me as you predict. That is because the people around me are very intelligent and can see the analogy is accurate instead of having an ignorant, race-based, knee-jerk, emotional reaction.

Now, since you clearly don't possess the testicular fortitude to discuss the premise of this thread, please stop wasting everyone's time. Troll somewhere else. Maybe you'll be able to make salient points on other topics.